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-   -   Water + ethanol/isopropyl (http://www.aquamist.co.uk/forum2/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=1754)

Pat32 03-05-2010 01:41 PM

Water + ethanol/isopropyl
 
Hello,

At the moment, I want to stay clear from Methanol and I am investigating alternatives.

Could someone please let me know which of the options below would be the best for my HSF3?

100% Water
95% Water & 5% Ethanol
75% Water & 25% isopropanyl

Any risks of damaging the hsf3 running ethanol/isopropanyl at the levels indicated above? Should I stick to 100% water if there is any potential for damage?

If there are any other non-toxic chemicals, please let me know.

Thanks

Richard L 03-05-2010 06:15 PM

Re: Water + ethanol/isopropyl
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pat32 (Post 12702)
Hello,

At the moment, I want to stay clear from Methanol and I am investigating alternatives.

Could someone please let me know which of the options below would be the best for my HSF3?

100% Water
95% Water & 5% Ethanol
75% Water & 25% isopropanyl

Any risks of damaging the hsf3 running ethanol/isopropanyl at the levels indicated above? Should I stick to 100% water if there is any potential for damage?

If there are any other non-toxic chemicals, please let me know.

Thanks

Pat,

I wouldn't recommend using iso-p due to the following write-up (long)
http://www.aquamist.co.uk/vbulletin/...ead.php?t=1707

I think ethanol is a good althernative to methanol but more expensive. If you go a de-natured alcohol (95% ethanol +ethanol), it will not much cheaper. HFS-3 will tolerate ethanol and methanol. But depend on the denaturant use on the de-natured alcohol, I cannot guarantee the effect.

Richard

Pat32 04-05-2010 09:35 AM

Re: Water + ethanol/isopropyl
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard L (Post 12705)
Pat,

I wouldn't recommend using iso-p due to the following write-up (long)
http://www.aquamist.co.uk/vbulletin/...ead.php?t=1707

I think ethanol is a good althernative to methanol but more expensive. If you go a de-natured alcohol (95% ethanol +ethanol), it will not much cheaper. HFS-3 will tolerate ethanol and methanol. But depend on the denaturant use on the de-natured alcohol, I cannot guarantee the effect.

Richard

Thanks for the info Richard! Im trying to stay away from Methanol due to the health risks so trying to find a safer alternative.

Just to confirm, any level of ethanol is safe for use in the HSF3? (including the pump?) Its just a matter of the denature added? (usually methanol from what I can see)
ie. 50% methylated spirit (95-98% ethanol & 5-2% methanol) : 50% Water

Thanks again

edit: Stumbled across this; http://www.recochem.com.au/index.php...daa_industrial
Thats the closest I can get without requiring any licenses lol
Hopefully they dont charge too much :x

Richard L 08-05-2010 12:54 PM

Re: Water + ethanol/isopropyl
 
If you vent the tank externally, I can't see there are any undue risks.

As far as I know, the wetted parts of HFS-3 is methanol/ethanol resistant. For long term usage, it will deteriorate. This will apply to any pump.This advice is given to us by Aquatec USA- our pump maker.

50:50 is much kinder. What other chemicals are in the methylated spriit? I am referring to the that ~1% denaturants.

PobodY 21-04-2012 08:37 AM

Re: Water + ethanol/isopropyl
 
Again, sorry to re-animate dead threads...

Is the issue with these mixtures to do with the formation of azeotropes? - I was also thinking about other alcohols that could be mixed with water; they are, after all, pretty similar (one alcohol functional group, and slightly different chains on the end).
However, one thing I noticed is that methanol has no azeotrope with water (in that if you mix them you don't get a "super solution" with properties different from either of the constituents), but ethanol, n/iso-propanol, x-butanol, etc all do.

So a methanol/water mixture can be separated back into methanol and water; each with its own boiling point (and therefore, I assume, heat capacity). However when you put isopropanol or ethanol into the mix you get an azeotrope with a much lower boiling point.

Similarly (because I've seen it in another thread) methanol and nitromethane form an azeotrope at 9% nitromethate; that will boil at a slightly lower temperature than methanol alone (and a lot lower than nitromethane alone).

This got me thinking; is there a way to make this work to our advantage? Perhaps a negative ternary azeotrope which is better than all the constituents...

...but it also occurs to me that I might be thinking too much, and that I should just stick to what it known to work.

OLD-N-GREY 07-02-2015 07:52 AM

Re: Water + ethanol/isopropyl
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pat32 (Post 12702)
Hello,

At the moment, I want to stay clear from Methanol and I am investigating alternatives.

Could someone please let me know which of the options below would be the best for my HSF3?

100% Water
95% Water & 5% Ethanol
75% Water & 25% isopropanyl

Any risks of damaging the hsf3 running ethanol/isopropanyl at the levels indicated above? Should I stick to 100% water if there is any potential for damage?

If there are any other non-toxic chemicals, please let me know.

Thanks

G'day, Please help, What is HSF3.??? ... Does Water+Methanol provide a great

cooling effects to Engine Intakes.??? ... Is the Purpose of the Mix to, Eliminate

carbon buildup in combustion chambers.??? ... Or Increase Power.??? ... Reduce

the risk of detonation.??? ... Without a mass of Control/Adjustment for Tuning

Devices.??? ... or all of the Above.???

I Wish to Improve the life and longevity of my 2 Classic Cars, by adding a simple

Water/Alcohol injection System, I believe this to be Possible.!! ... Without a Pump, ... Any reason why it can't be Sucked in.???

Thanks


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