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waterinjection.info (http://www.aquamist.co.uk/forum2/vbulletin/index.php)
-   Aquamist HFS-3 forum (http://www.aquamist.co.uk/forum2/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=34)
-   -   Flickering blue light ? (http://www.aquamist.co.uk/forum2/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=3162)

Richard L 12-03-2019 09:49 AM
Re: Flickering blue light ?
 
you can send the controller back to me and I can increase the hysteresis or take more samples on the incoming idc signal.

Only the relay contacts will be affected.

jondee86 13-03-2019 09:38 AM
Re: Flickering blue light ?
 
Thanks for the offer Richard. I have a couple of events coming up and
I need to get the W/M injection dialled in. So I will try controlling the relay
with my ECU first. It is an easily reversible modification and essentially
just open circuits your relay control wiring and switches control to the ECU
by running a single new wire.

If need be I can take up your offer or change back to wasted spark later
in the year. But providing I can get a clean turn ON and OFF for the pump
the system should work fine.

Cheers... jondee86

jondee86 16-03-2019 04:43 AM
Re: Flickering blue light ?
 
System is working as expected with a clean turn ON. However, even with the
GAIN set to maximum CW the flowmeter count shows that flow is pretty much
flatlined. There is a very slight rise, but flow is not tracking IDC. From this I
conclude that the installed nozzles are at their maximum flow and I need to
step up one size ??

No problem, I can do that. At the moment I can just control MAT rise on cooler
days and I would like to have a bit of capacity in hand for warmer weather.

Cheers... jondee86

Richard L 16-03-2019 08:49 AM
Re: Flickering blue light ?
 
You need a large nozzle to extend your flow range. Increasing the GAIN only flattens the flow earlier (dotted red line). Image extracted from the user manual. please read the manual as there are many information regarding your application.

http://www.aquamist.co.uk/forum/GAIN trimmer.gif

jondee86 16-03-2019 11:06 PM
Re: Flickering blue light ?
 
I have read the manual many times and have a reasonable understanding
of the function of the controls. What is not immediately apparent to a user
such as myself, is how the controls and hardware interact to affect W/M
delivery.

In this case, with the small FAV restrictor flow did track IDC. But when
I changed to the larger restrictor it did not, although flow was well short
of 95% IDC. I expected that increasing the GAIN would have the effect
shown in the graph only this did not happen.

After checking my logs I can see that installing the larger restrictor did not
increase W/M delivery at higher IDC. But did increase delivery at lower IDC,
and I conclude that flow is now being controlled by the size of the nozzles
rather than by changes in IDC.

As you say, and no doubt it is obvious to experienced users, increasing the
nozzle size is the next step. I am still learning about these things :)

Cheers... jondee86

jondee86 17-03-2019 03:35 AM
Re: Flickering blue light ?
 
Changed the 04b to a 0.50 nozzle and the flowmeter count now
follows IDC (+/-). However MAT is not being controlled so well as
with the previous "choked" W/M delivery. I put this down to the
fact that with the smaller nozzle delivery went immediately to near
maximum output, and remained at that level as IDC increased.

I think that this put more mix into the intake ducting at initiation
and helped reduce the temperature of the heat soaked intake
ducting. Now the system initiates at a lower flow rate and ramps
up, so that it takes a bit longer to overcome the effects of heat
soak. I have only done a couple of short low gear pulls so far
that are inconclusive.

Tomorrow I will find a place where I can do a longer 4th gear pull
and see if the MAT goes up and then starts to reduce once the
intake ducting has been exposed to the spray for a few seconds.

Cheers... jondee86

Richard L 17-03-2019 08:52 AM
Re: Flickering blue light ?
 
With careful matching you should achieve this:

Magenta = PWM input
cyan = signal from flow sensor (-0.5V offset)

http://www.aquamist.co.uk/NEW/FAV-log.jpg

More info: http://www.aquamist.co.uk/forum2/vbu...ead.php?t=2733

Richard L 17-03-2019 09:07 AM
Re: Flickering blue light ?
 
We can supply a fully matched system but it will be costly. The FAV orifice will be constructed for a specific flow range. It is mainly for OE application on one model of car.

The restrictor is a good compromise for lower flow. If you are flowing in the region 500-1000cc/min, the standard system performs well.

Richard L 17-03-2019 09:10 AM
Re: Flickering blue light ?
 
In you case, you need a lo-flow FAV and flow sensor, You are operating slightly outside the ideal range.

You can run two jets, one jet (with inline CV) goes back to the water tank. Other than this I cannot see a good solution.

Richard L 17-03-2019 09:31 AM
Re: Flickering blue light ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jondee86 (Post 24733)
27-02-19 existing setting as base. Injection initiates ~ 14% IDC. Flickering.
28-02-19 plus 1/2 click on THRES. Injection initiates ~ 17% IDC. No change.
01-03-19 plus 1 click on THRES. Injection initiates ~ TBA. Test deferred.

Deferred raising THRES as I need to get on the motorway to monitor MAT
vs IDC at constant speed. Will do that when I get a chance. But I did have
a short drive to try a few different settings of WL and WH. Tried them both
at 12 o'clock and then with WL full ACW and WH full CW... neither affected
the flickering, but did change the failsafe behavior.

My log shows that the system is becoming active (showing flowmeter output) at IDC levels below the nominal 17% IDC initiate THRES setting. In several
places I can see flowmeter output values of 1, 2 or 3 continuously for periods
when the IDC is at 13-14%, particularly when the throttle is being gradually
opened. With more rapid opening of the throttle the flowmeter indicates a
"clean" turn on and a clean cutoff at around 17-18% IDC.

This suggests that the pump turns on before the FAV becomes active, and
that "leakage" past the valve is ocurring ? Does the pump have some
hysterisis to make sure it is up to speed by the time the FAV initiates ?
In the region of 12-14%, hysteresis is as as effective as the incoming IDC signal sampling rate is slow. Solution: use your ECU to output a PWM signal at 200Hz or more. We have now gone full circle.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jondee86 (Post 24733)
I also noted that the water level light is illuminating for around 3 seconds
pretty much every time I apply a decent amount of throttle to initiate spray.
But I can't tell if the onset of spray is delayed until the light goes out ?

If it helps, the only thing I haven't done that may be pertinent, is add the
solder blob to change the flowmeter resolution. I am running two jets
(1 x 0.7 and 1 x0.4B) with the 380cc/min FAV restrictor.

Cheers... jondee86
Does your dash gauge have two yellow leds so to distinguish between water level and failsafe trigger? You also need to reduce the WL (CCW) to avoid failsafe triggering.

Worth linking 1&2 on the flow table as it will give your a better resolution in you low operation range.


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