HFS-6 problems

[Dragoneletra]

My name is Jon, i'm from Darwin, Australia. I recently purchased a kit from a place here for my supercharged straight 6 cylinder falcon wagon.

I'm having some strange problems with the kit for some reason and am at a bit of a loss to work out what is wrong.

Problem #1
I've installed the system as per the instructions and had it working all ok except for a couple of bugs every now and then. The system was working fine, though I had forgotten to plug in the level sender. Since i've plugged that in the system seems to be turning off by itself for some reason. The dark yellow/orange level sensor light is staying on 'all' the time and the system will not reset ? I've checked my wiring connections and i'm confident they all seem ok. From what I have read the system is shutoff due to the level sensor being on for more than 20 seconds ? Is this what is happening ? And why won't it restart ?

Problem #2
On turning the key to acc. For some reason the pump starts to automatically pump water after 5-10 seconds (the usual system startup time) Though if you move the key to 'run' the pump will not engage unless the engine is running.

I have wired the system in onto an accessory switched 12 volt circuit rather than #2 switched circuit. This should not affect how the system runs or make the pump start pumping water into the intake by istelf. It's a bit of a pain because the water will flow back to the supercharger one way and the throttle body the other as the jets are installed at the highest point.

On turning the key to #2 (run) the W.INJ light was coming on (now it's not since i've been having problems) and the S lights up as it should (pre problems anyway)

On starting everything was working as it should.

I have currently wired the system in this way:

Feed for HFS cpu:
Red - switched 12V on cigarette lighter
Black - Negative return on lighter
White - Negative return on lighter

Yellow RJ45:
Ignition switched 12 volt (i'm pretty sure, once i've finished this i'll go check)
green - injector number 1 for duty cycle.
I wish to hook up the map sensor link as well later.

I have not changed any settings as yet. It's as factory set apart from the bars graph on the guage. I'm a bit confused as to what to do next because the fault seems to be intermittent.

Do I need to use the level sensor ? Can you bypass it ? As I wish to put in a different leve sender in as well, one with a led light and one with a little buzzer that will run seperately to the system. I have a 24litre tank though so it's not really a concern anyways.

Something I noticed today:

When the guage is showing just the orange level sensor light and refusing to turn on, if I remove the blue RJ45 jack from the control box and plug it back in again, the guage turns on and the system will work for a short period of time before turning off again. The blue RJ45 plug LED on the control box is not the green/yellow colour either, it's more orange compared to the res of them. So I am pretty certain that the problem is something to do with the level sensor, hopefully I can get enough information from here because noone else remotely near where I live has ever heard of these kits and the suppliers don't know much either, so i'm on my own.

Thanks muchly in advance.

jon

[Richard L]

Hello Jon of Darwin,

It appears that you have done a very nice installation job on getting the system work as designed.

I have read through your post and I would like to make the following points related to the problen you have encountered.

Problem #1

The level sensor will disable the system from starting up upon power-up if wtare level is below the sensor. A warning led on the guage will stay on unteil the tank is replenished. During active service, a timer/counter monitors the level full time. If the level is near the triggerng point, it will allow the led to flash but will not disable the system from spraying nor triggering the failsafe. When the duty cycle of the low level sensor is approaching 95%, it will trigger the failsafe and turn the gauge led on full time. The syetm will not reset until tank is refilled. This is to prevent and air getting into the system and causes air lock in the pump head.

Problem #2

This is a classic and the most frequent mistake. The system should never be allowed to power up at the "acc" position. This point is highlighed pn page 11.2 of the user manual. Reinstate the red wire of the yellow connector to a 12V source where "only becomes" active at the "pre-crank" key position. The best place is the fuel injector (+).

You are 95% there.

I will deal with the rest when the two above problems are resolved.

[Dragoneletra]

Hi Richard, Thanks for the prompt reply !

Problem #1
The water tank is almost full, and has been for some time, since before the level sensor was connected. Which is why I think there is a fault. It is installed right way up etc. I am wondering if I can reset or bypass the system. Does what I have described tie in to when you unplug the blue RJ45 and have the system working ok ?

Problem #2
I'll go out now and fix that issue. I'm getting pretty good at pulling the wife's car apart these days...lol.
The only cable I was going to run off the #2 run position will be the red wire to the 4 way power connector on the controller box ? will the yellow RJ45 connector be needing to be connected to the #2 switched positive as well ??

Thanks again.

[Dragoneletra]

Ok.
both the aforementioned power wires are now connected to a power source switched by the #2 position on the key.

On start up proceedure the system behaves exactly as it is supposed to, except the guage does not turn on, just the yellow light on the water level led on constantly.

The pump did not auto start because the guage did not turn on i'm guessing, unless that fault has been rectified by changing the power source, though i'm not sure how that would fix it.

edit/update
If I unplug the level sender from the pump, the system seems to work perfectly. Except the level sender yellow/orange light flickers and the B failsafe light is flickering.
Once I plugged the level sender back in again, the system has worked correctly. The level sender indicator light is not showing yellow/orange. Both the WINJ and water level yellow/green LED's are on constantly. One thing i've noticed is the B failsafe light will be on at idle and flickering up to about 1400RPM. Once you pass that or put any load on the engine, the B light vanishes until the revs return to that level.

I figure the more information I post here the more helpful it will be to diagnose, or if someone else has similar problems...

[Richard L]

Your post has helped with the diagnosis greatly, thnak you. OK, system is working logically as the power wires are being reloacted, good to move the the next stage.

It appears the water level sensor is the problem area. please check the following:

1. The lever arm of the flow sensor must point upwards when the tank is fully filled. If not, rotate it 180 degrees.
2. Check the wiring order of the 4-pin blue RJ connector. The colour order should be red, green, orange, white, yellow, blue, black and brown counting from the gauge harness side.

PS I saw the pictures you posted of the car, awesome racer and will upset a few people on the highway.

[Dragoneletra]

Hmm
I don't know why, but the system is now working as it should. Level sensor is not coming on for no reason, guage is working and system seems to be working as well.
Very strange.
Sender is correct as is plug.
Perhaps i'll just leave it and see how long it stays working correctly. With a bit of luck it might have just sorted itself out.

the only thing is the B light coming on often. This is because the system is spraying too much water, is that correct ?

I changed the system settings to bring the water on a about 3000rpm, though my car doesn't make much boost until about 4000rpm. I figured that the WI would be better going in earlier. The rest of the settings haven't changed.
so Perhaps i'm not spraying 'too' early, just too much, too early ?

And the wagon is something different. Some people hate it, others think it's pretty cool. The huge hood scoop does catch the eye a little though. But it's pretty quick around town, which people definately don't expect out of a wagon..

[Richard L]

Good to know the system is working as designed.

Intermittant problem is normally associated with electrical shorting of cables. Check the entire length of the trunk cable (blue harness). Pay special attention to the green and yellow strand of the 8-core cable. If the yellow is shorted to ground, the water level led will come on.

[Dragoneletra]

No worries, thanks a lot for your help !

Do you have any suggestions for flow rates etc ? Or is that more a hands on thing ?
It's hard for me to test because you can't feel what the water is doing to the car when it's being injected, I think a dyno is the way to tune it properly. I do know it made an extra 8rwkw when I installed the system and tested it on the dyno, but it hasn't been fine tuned.

[Richard L]

injection rate ralative to fuel flow:

Use the following guide line normally works well:
100% water ................. 10-15% to fuel flow
M50:W50 ..................... 15-20% to fuel flow
100% methanol ............. 20-25% to fuel flow

Injection rate over 10-15% should be tuned.


The above range allows for fuel quality and charge air temperature.