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  #81  
Old 21-12-2017, 11:27 PM
rotrex rotrex is offline
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Default Re: Nozzle spray angle...

if you manage to achieve max torque before knock occurs, you could consider injecting less or run more boost.
if you you do not manage to get to MBT timing due to knock, you could inject more.
if you get misfires, you also might inject too much for you ignition system to cope with.
once you run it tad leaner than 10:1 while injecting the engine will wake up.
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  #82  
Old 23-12-2017, 04:17 AM
jondee86 jondee86 is offline
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Talking Re: Nozzle spray angle...

OK. MBT tuning will have to wait until I get the car on a dyno. In the meantime
I will keep tweaking the fuel table to get the AFR while injecting into the low 11's.
Engine is running well with no sign of any hesitation under load. Did a 3rd gear pull
on the highway today and managed 199.6kPa when hitting the rev limiter. Or at
least I thought it was the limiter until I checked my log and found that I hit boost
cut at 197kPa. Didn't realise I had an overboost cut set, so maybe next time I will
manage to struggle past the magic 200kPa mark

Cheers... jondee86
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  #83  
Old 12-01-2018, 06:59 AM
jondee86 jondee86 is offline
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Question Re: Nozzle spray angle...

Had to enpty my tank and refill it today, and noticed that the methanol
smell did not seem as strong as when I first mixed this tank (50/50 w/w).
So is there a use by date for mix ? This tank would be about 6 weeks old
and I have only used about 1/3 of the 10 litre tank.

Cheers... jondee86
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  #84  
Old 12-01-2018, 10:54 AM
rotrex rotrex is offline
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Default Re: Nozzle spray angle...

no, unless you leave the reservoir cap off, a 50:50 (wt) mix will last pretty much for ever.
Do not use an aluminium tank for any methanol formulations unless it is coated on the inside with a appropriate coating.
Polymer containers work the best.

Air will slowly oxidises methanol in formaldehyde and formic acid. This in itself won't really bother your injection system.
Formic acid and methanol itself will slowly react into a ester with a distinct smell.
Methanol will react with formaldehyde forming hemiacetals and acetals. These have a distinct smell.
These chemical reactions of "aging" methanol exposed to air are very similar to what happens in raging spirits like whiskey or wine.
Their smell gets more complex over time as the above compounds are formed.
They all burn well and are only formed in rather small quantities with low reaction speeds given you start with high purity methanol.

Very high purity methanol has no intense distinct smell at all. It is almost odourless.

Ph.D chemist here. I have worked in the past with HPLC grade very high purity methanol and had a sniff. Natural curiosity.

The more "technical" grade it gets, the more off a soapy or booze like smell it gets.
As a mix with water, the oder intensity drops even more.

Some of the compounds you can smell are very volatile and easily vent off if you open the container. I'd not be surprised if you sometimes smell something and sometimes not.
Propanol and butanol have a smell that reminds me of technical grade methanol, especially when sprayed or hot.

This could depend of how long it was open before you exposed you nose to vapours, if the reservoir as cold or warm, direction of the wind....

When my car went into storage over winter, I have always drained the water methanol system.

Last edited by rotrex; 12-01-2018 at 11:02 AM.
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  #85  
Old 12-01-2018, 01:03 PM
UCTURBO UCTURBO is offline
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Default Re: Nozzle spray angle...

If anyone is curious, I mix my 50/50 with pure methanol and tap water and it stays 100% clear but when I add a small amount of methanol lube it goes cloudy and heats up quite a bit more. The only reason for the lube is I have some coated mild steel springs in my DP check valves that rust without it. It seems to stay mixed for as long as I need it to lol. Cheers
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  #86  
Old 12-01-2018, 09:47 PM
jondee86 jondee86 is offline
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Default Re: Nozzle spray angle...

All good then I am using a Pe container and I had to syphon the mix out
of the tank into other containers and that took a while. So any smell that had
accumulated in the tank would have dissipated while I was syphoning the mix out.

Got a few fine days now so I shall see if I can use up another couple of litres

Cheers... jondee86
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  #87  
Old 16-04-2018, 08:42 AM
jondee86 jondee86 is offline
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Talking Re: Nozzle spray angle...

Bit of an update with progress. I re-tuned my fuel map to take into
account the enrichment provided by the WM injection. Took a while
and then I learned that I can set the end of (fuel) injection timing
with my ECU, and that threw the fuel map out again... so re-tuning
again at the moment.

Also tweaking the point at which WM injection starts when cruising.
At the moment it kicks in at around 110km/h and since I solved the
problem I had with the bypass valve not opening, my MAT's have
reduced to acceptable levels during around town and cruise. There
is still some work to be done but the car is running well and I have
been able to enter a few local events like this one...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8pSyUqAevKA

I have had to up the idle to 1250rpm to get above the annoying gear
rattle from the s/c. Othere than that this setup just keeps getting
better and better. Not overly fast, but oooooohhhh... that midrange

Cheers... jondee86
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  #88  
Old 22-04-2018, 02:12 AM
jondee86 jondee86 is offline
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Default Re: Nozzle spray angle...

I am attempting to resolve a tip-in misfire that can be seen here...



When starting to accelerate, TPS movement invokes some "throttle pump"
enrichment, and the increase in injector duty cycle triggers the WM injection.
This appears to cause a rich misfire that shows as a lean spike in the AFR.
My WM injection initiates at around 10% IDC as in the absence of an inter-
cooler, I use WM for charge cooling once the car reaches around 110 kph
while cruising.

I have a number of adjustments for both fuel and WM injection, and to help
with getting the balance right, it would be nice to be able to log the actual
onset of WM injection and the rate of injection.

From reading the HFS-2/3.1 manual I gain the impression that if I use the
Green Harness I should be able to output a 0-5V signal from my HFS-3 to
a spare 0-5V analog input on my ECU.

EDIT: OK, looks like the yellow wire on the green (USER) plug should give me
the information I require, so I will go with that.

Can someone please confirm that my understanding on this is correct ?

Cheers... jondee86

Last edited by jondee86; 25-04-2018 at 02:51 AM.
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  #89  
Old 31-05-2018, 07:13 AM
jondee86 jondee86 is offline
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Smile Re: Nozzle spray angle...

Got the flowmeter output in my logs now, and it shows me when the WM
injection triggers and how the flow varies with rpm. Now I can fiddle with
the various trims available to adjust bothe the trigger point and injection
rate to try and get a better match to my fuel injection IDC graph.

Finally managed to find a decent OEM bypass valve (off a turbo Legacy)
that I could modify to fit my Bosch based bypass pipework layout. Should
allow a bit more air to flow when out of boost, which should in turn help
my out of boost cruising manifold air temps. Will be testing this in the next
couple of days to se if it performs as expected.

Cheers... jondee86
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  #90  
Old 12-06-2018, 03:16 AM
jondee86 jondee86 is offline
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Question Re: Nozzle spray angle...

New bypass valve is up and running...



Works great and seems to pass a bit more air than the old system, so I am
having to re-tune my VE map below 85kPa. Engine pulls hard all the way to
my 8000rpm redline with virtually no dropoff in acceleration. I am considering
getting a 65dia s/c pulley to replace the 75dia pulley I have at the moment.
This would mean dropping my redline to 7000rpm to avoid overspeeding the
s/c but I don't see this as a problem. It should help the engine live longer.

Currently I am chasing the misfire that I get when I accelerate hard in any
gear from around 2500rpm. It only happens once about a second after I hit
the throttle, and I have not noticed any misfiring further up the rpm range.

Bearing in mind the earlier comment made by rotrex about spray killing the
spark, I did wonder if that might be the problem. Hard acceleration at around
2500rpm invokes extra enrichment and also triggers the W/M spray. But when
I switched off the W/M spray the misfire still occured, so now I am adjusting
the enrichment tables to see if I can find an answer.

Cheers... jondee86

Last edited by jondee86; 12-06-2018 at 03:36 AM.
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