The unit is suppose to modify the fuel delivery. In order for WI injection to play an active part in power making, the air/fuel ratio has to be corrected.

In almost all turbo cars, it tends to run rich to so the fuel is used as a coolant. But rich a/f ratio also robs power. So if we can replace those extra fuel by water, it is the most ideal setup for water injection. The unit do just that.

Water injection is effective on retaining your power in the summer by keeping the charge temperarture down but in winter, it tends to rob power due to over cooling. Reducing rich fuel mixture will allow more heat available for power.

Does it make sense?

Richard

What you are saying makes sence, but I'd like to see it thoughly tested beforeusing it on my car as I'm sur eyou know the consequences of running the car too lean at high boost.

I won't be taking any unnecessary risks - will porbably calibrate it on a dyno rather on road.

After all, this what WI is originally designed for - replacing excess fuel. The above unit is quite safe, it reads the lambda and if it go lean, the voltage converter will switch off automatically.

If the unit proved to be effective, might fit a DDS3 to monitor water flow. The unit is also capable of modifying the fuel in relationship with water flow adn well as monitoring the lambda at the same time.... This will be almost be 99% bullet proof. The unit is not expensibe to produce either.

Richard

Here is a chart shows how the little unit work:

http://www.aquamist.co.uk/forum/gall...-converter.gif

What connections will the maf converter need to the car ?

There is a multicore cable that goes to the MAF sensor on the Astra:
1) 0V
2) +5V
3) +12V
4) MAF OUTPUT (0-5V)

The converter splice ionto the cut MAF cable. We also use the +12V and 0V for powering the converter.

Quite simple.

Richard

Will it need connecting to the 1s kit and the dds3 ?

I have made provison on the prototype to sense the pressure switch of the 1s, when the 1s triggers, it will automatically start the conversion.

I have also made available an extra input to read the DDS3's flow signal (50-450cc/min) so the converter trims the fuel proportiional to water flow.

All these facilities are waiting to be tested. I am still a bit tied up at present. The unit has already been made sometime ago but yet to find time to try it. It all work as intended on the beanch.

Richard

Looks like Ive been missing out on some interesting developments :cool:

Sorry Richard - I haven't been able to get those figures to you as my car has been of the road with a major electrical fault. Maybe you can help with your knowledge of electrics? See this post for more info:
http://www.migweb.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=244956

I have just read the post on the other forum.

I don't know what has happened. It appeared that this was a short somewhere and cause some ECU malfunction. I wonder if you can unplug the battery for an hour or so to reset the ECU. But your window circuit may need hardware attention. Resetting theECU is your first priorirt.

Richard

PS I stay tune and any update. You have some diagnostic software, would it work?

I got on to the Migweb forum and gather that you have cured your electrical problem - all cuased bya loose earth terminal.

Well done.

So when will you be free to advance our little project?

Whenever really. I can get a day off, or do a saturday if you want. Are you going to book a rolling road to check it all out or will we just test the system works for now? I look forward to it. :)

You will have to let me know the result. Got a R/R day on feb 25th and would like to have that bit more power for my mods ! :wink: Hope it all go's well.

I will organise the rolling going for you.

We must get the converter installed and check all its non-conversion mode switched on. I need you to get familiar with lambda readings over a short period (bargraph).

I am happy with the coming Saturday or any week day next week, just let me know.

Richard

Richard if all goes well, I will be interested in aquiring this converter, will you be marketing it ? How much will it cost ? :cool: :cool:

I am not sure if this item is going to be manufactured, need to test the effectiveness first.

The cost will be low since there are no power switching components and no mechanical parts, just purely signal processing. Propbaly packaged with a WI system as a bundled kit. It has to be a car specific as we can't market it as a universal converter.

The reason why I went this route was our user has to pay a noticeable fee for some tuning company to access their ECU juist to take some fuel off in order to get the best out of WI.

In most cases, the tuner is reluctant to do it because the risk of running the engine too lean in absence of WI even a "failsafe" mechanism is available at hand.

Mike was a fine example. Without looking into the reason for loosing power, most people will just put the loss due to WI and not because the water was wetting the sensor causing it to run pig rich etc.

The first 30-50 horse power is quite easy to extract from a factory turbo car. But unfortunately by the time people considering WI as a power adder, most of the flow capacity to make power is used up. This is the reason why WI has never received a fair fight on the power game.

I hope that one day we can turn this around and see if anyone can extract more power from a set up after WI is fully exploited. It will be interesting. I hope by looking into supplying a tuning tool with WI (as with the converter), people may consider WI as their first tuning step.

Richard

Thats ok, mines an Astra zlet engine, the same as Mikes. :cool:

Is it not possible to allow a controlled volume of unmetered air enter the inlet tract after the AFM, to lean up the mixture when WI is activated ? Filtered obviously.

Surely you must be able to calculate a fixed diameter opening to weaken the mixture by a known percentage, which would be opened by a selonoid triggered by the WI circuitry ?

Say for example

5mm = 5%
7mm = 10%
9mm = 15% etc

Hello Gelf,

I am sure it is possible to do it. It is not easy for me to test the method machanically as it requires some intense flow calculation and then machine something out to do it - the flow through a irregular path of a solenoid is quite complicated.

It is simplier for me to alter the electrial signal of the MAF.

Richard

Mike,

I am OK for this week, are you available?

How long do we need? Would turning up at 12:20 at some point this week give us enough time?

I will do what I can with whatever timing available.

I am just wire the unit and test if is reads the sensors properly. I think testing and tuning with the unit wil be another date on a dyno.

You can watch all the led flickering but it will not do any modifications to your fueling. It is also useful to see the lambda readings.

12.20pm is fine, just tellme the night before.

richard@aquamist.co.uk

Richard

Richard - How about tomorrow (Wednesday)?

Perfect. I will see you at 12.20pm.

Richard

Richard, contact Jon @ Courtenay if you want to discuss it with a tuner as I'm sure he'd like to hear what you have to say!

Have spoken to Jon this morning, he has found this project very interesting. He is looking forward to try it once the protptypen has worked properly.

Mike made it to me noon today and manged to run all the wires and test one function. Run out of time for get the rest tested and working.
The lambda part work very well. The bargraph tracks lambda voltage happily without any effort. I will be able to finish it on Friday.

The entire wiring was re-done. Now we have a 12-core cable lonking the engine bay and glove compartment.

Richard

My WI is still not being used so I am looking at this before I deside what to do with it, being winter there's no rush.

Richard - Thanks again for yesterday, hopefully we can complete the installation on Friday.

The car does not feel like it is losing power with water injection on anymore. It was difficult to tell before if there was a difference (after the jet was moved), I think this may have been down to the bad earth problem I had which may have restricted the power to the fuel pump - as the car generally felt slower anyway. (I thought I was getting used to it!).

It is a pity I didn't bring my camera with me - could I have a copy of the photos you took please? The installation is almost hillariously neat - I'm very pleased with it.

I look forward to Friday. I'll be leaving Falmer at 4pm, so should be with you by 4.30pm.

I will be at courtenays on there R/R in mid feb having a map put in. Hopefully my WI will all be fitted and working by then. After that hopefully fit richards little box of tricks and see what kind of power increase there is ! :wink:

Mike,

I will put everything onto a CD fior Friday, from day1.

Friday:
It won't take long to plud the unit in. We need to find a place to tempaorary mount it so that you can see what is going on. I will set the unit for zero convert but you can still see the the lights flashing on and off.

Richard

I will certainly try to get thing moving as quickly as possible. I would allow the unit to run a week to see if every part is working correctly before booking a RR session.

If the unit is effective, I will make a few more prototypes.

Richard

Richard - I got your email. See you tomorrow. :)

Excellent, can I put my name down for beta testing :razz:

yes, of course.

Richard - it all seems to be functioning correctly. The WI won't come on any lower than 3.8v at the air flow meter, so I guess this is the lowest flow at which the 10psi can be gained. Lambda seems spot on too.

Thanks for the MAF information. I guess it means when the MAF reads 3.8V, the boost is at 13psi?
I can't remember at what boost the WI triggers. Can you?

I have a few pictures here I took a few days ago.

http://www.aquamist.co.uk/forum/gallery/astra/1.jpg

http://www.aquamist.co.uk/forum/gallery/astra/2.jpg

http://www.aquamist.co.uk/forum/gallery/astra/3.jpg

http://www.aquamist.co.uk/forum/gall...tra/Dash-s.jpg

10psi.

Thanks Mike.

The MAF threshold is between 2.6V to 4.85 volts.
Each click of the trreshold potentiometer is about 0.11V.

11 clicks will arrive at the WI triggering point (3.8V). If you have a moment, could you advance the threshold potentiometer by 10 clicks (not 11), if things work as intended, the yollow led will come on almost immediately after the MAF converter is enabled by the system1s WI.

Things are looking good.

Richard

Richard - I thought the threshold was between 3 and 5v. It takes 8 clicks to get the lowest voltage the WI triggers with.