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  #1  
Old 19-08-2004, 07:20 PM
THE ICE MAN THE ICE MAN is offline
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Default WHAT AM I LOOKING FOR ON MY A/F RATIO

I want to make sure i am going to be doing this right.
I am installing on a 1300cc engine with 10.5 to1 compression
and will be running 6 and 9 lbs of boost on high.
My question is do i tune it to 12.5 to1 without the water injection
then put water on, or do I tune it to 12.5 to1 with water inj.
If I tune it to 12.5 to1 without water inj. what will I see on my AFR when I turn the water inj. on?
I have a .5mm jet.
I will be running 50/50 pump and race gas at 105.5 octane
Thanks alot guys.
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  #2  
Old 19-08-2004, 07:24 PM
THE ICE MAN THE ICE MAN is offline
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One more thing this will be used for1 mile drag racing.
if there is two different a/f ratios 1 for street and 1 for track let me know
Thanks again.
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  #3  
Old 19-08-2004, 07:40 PM
JohnA JohnA is offline
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My understanding is that you can run leaner with the W.I. working.

In any case I wouldn't trust the AFR readings while WI is operating, kinda like nitrous. So I'd set the fuelling without the WI operating.

Is that a Hayabusa? :P
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  #4  
Old 19-08-2004, 07:55 PM
THE ICE MAN THE ICE MAN is offline
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John,
Yes a hayabusa and a gsxr1000
Set it at 12.5to1 then turn on the water?
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  #5  
Old 19-08-2004, 08:31 PM
JohnA JohnA is offline
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Have you got stock pistons/gasket?

Your conservative boost setting would indicate so anyway :wink:
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  #6  
Old 19-08-2004, 08:53 PM
THE ICE MAN THE ICE MAN is offline
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The 1000 motor I just finished, it has stock pistons, the stock comp, was 12.1
I lowered it to 10.5 to1

The hayabusa is not ready yet that one will have turbo pistons and spacer plate set at 9.0 to1 and will run higher boost 15-20 lbs

I still need to know at what A/F ratio I should use with & without water?
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  #7  
Old 20-08-2004, 10:05 AM
JohnA JohnA is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by THE ICE MAN
...I still need to know at what A/F ratio I should use with & without water?
It depends on the Comp Ratio, among others.
If the CR has been lowered enough (relative to boost levels) then you can run a bit leaner than otherwise.
With W.I. you can run a bit leaner still.

As a rule, with crap intercooling and inadequate CR lowering, AFR of 11:1 is a good idea
With good intercooling, low CR you can aim for 12:1
With W.I. on top, you're looking at 12.5-13.0:1 perhaps.

Of course cam timing, fuel quality and ignition timing will also affect things.
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  #8  
Old 20-08-2004, 10:31 PM
THE ICE MAN THE ICE MAN is offline
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Thanks John.
Any other replies welcome
I am trying to achieve at least 205MPH in less than 1 mile
on a 1000 suzuki with 230 H.P.
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  #9  
Old 21-08-2004, 05:13 PM
hotrod hotrod is offline
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Default AFR's

I sent you some stuff on this in answer to your PM, but in general you can run significantly leaner with adequate ADI ( sorry guys I prefer the air craft term of antidetonation injection because mixtures of water and alcohol can vary so much from user to user and folks seldom run just pure water).

If you have a quality AFR meter, then I would suggest you get a good max power tune dry and then add the ADI and see how the meter records the change in AFR. Then try a couple different mixtures of water and methanol, and see what happens.

I have seen some debate on how a meter will be effected but I have not seen anyone actually get experimental data.

You may not be able to get absolute fuel air ratios but if you know how much it is effected by the injectant mix you run you should be close enough for tuning purposes.

You may also want to touch base with the guys at RBRacing.
http://www.rbracing-rsr.com/bonneville2.htm
They seem to know what they are doing with this sort of thing.

Larry
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  #10  
Old 21-08-2004, 05:46 PM
THE ICE MAN THE ICE MAN is offline
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I checked out RBR racing and according to their chart they want to see a 12.5 to1 without water and then somewhere around 10.5-11.0 afr with the water injection based on 15-22% water injection
They say 12.5 to 1 air fuel
and 10.5 -11.1 AIR to (FLUIDS) RATIO water and fuel
They do the salt flats thats 2-3 mile runs!
and i am sure they went thru plenty of motors for their research

we are currently running a turbo 1000 now with stock compression
12.1 and we set the air fuel to 11.3-11.5 with 105.5 octane
minus 2 degrees timming
with myself as pilot i went 201.1 MPH in 9/10's of a mile

Heres were i dont know how far to push it
new bike 10.5 comp. and water inj
so maybe i can go a litle leaner than 11.3-11.5 with water??
or have my target 11.3-11.5 with water
Velocity racing does turbos for bikes i think they had problems at the begining setting them up in the 12. ? to 1 range without water on a 1 mile run so they went to the 11.3-11.8 range without water and everything was good.
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